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Meeting 2017 09 15
https://identi.ca/larjona/note/7LgYGWNSSW-GSsQ0T9ZROw
We're resuming our monthly community meeting!
We'll meet today Friday 2017/09/15 at 20:00 UTC on the #pump.io channel on the Freenode IRC network, which is also mirrored to the [email protected] jabber/XMPP MUC room.
You're all welcome to join us!
Agenda (editable) is here https://github.com/pump-io/pump.io/wiki/Meeting-2017-09-15
Feel free to add to this before the meeting!
- Status updates from last months
- Pump.io code development
- 5.0.0!!
- ActivityPub implementation
- CloudFlare DNS changes
- [email protected]
- Other
- Branding
- Community governance and sustainability
- Conservancy membership
- Node status
- Node adoption
- Funding
[22:25:04] <pumabot> #############################################################
[22:25:05] <pumabot> BEGIN LOG
[22:25:05] <pumabot> #############################################################
[22:25:05] <pumabot> Welcome to this month's Pump.io community meeting! Everyone is welcome to participate.
[22:25:05] <pumabot> This meeting is being logged and it will be posted on the wiki at https://github.com/e14n/pump.io/wiki/Meeting-2017-09-15. If you would like your nick redacted, please say so, either now or after the meeting.
[22:25:05] <pumabot> Let's start with roll call - who's here?
[22:25:05] -*- pumabot is here
[22:25:10] -*- strugee is here
[22:25:15] <strugee> bkuhn: no problem
[22:25:21] -*- jxself hovers
[22:25:47] <strugee> I believe larjona will be here soon too
[22:26:08] <strugee> lol I forgot pumabot's syntax
[22:26:11] <strugee> pumabot: help meeting
[22:26:11] <pumabot> pumabot <nick> is chairing - sets a new chair for the current meeting
[22:26:12] <pumabot> pumabot end meeting - thanks participants for coming and announces the end of the log
[22:26:12] <pumabot> pumabot meeting agenda - gives a reminder of the meeting agenda URL
[22:26:12] <pumabot> pumabot reload agenda - reloads the agenda of the active meeting
[22:26:12] <pumabot> pumabot start meeting - announces the meeting start and the beginning of logging, and starts roll call
[22:26:12] <pumabot> pumabot who's chairing? - says who is chairing the current meeting
[22:27:03] <strugee> pumabot: help agenda
[22:27:03] <pumabot> pumabot current agenda item - prints the current agenda topic
[22:27:03] <pumabot> pumabot meeting agenda - gives a reminder of the meeting agenda URL
[22:27:03] <pumabot> pumabot next agenda item - changes the current topic to the next item on the agenda
[22:27:03] <pumabot> pumabot previous agenda item - changes the current topic to the previous item on the agenda
[22:27:03] <pumabot> pumabot reload agenda - reloads the agenda of the active meeting
[22:27:14] <strugee> pumabot: next agenda item
[22:27:14] <pumabot> TOPIC: Pump.io code development
[22:27:15] <pumabot> * 5.0.0!!
[22:27:15] <pumabot> * ActivityPub implementation
[22:27:15] <pumabot> * CloudFlare DNS changes
[22:27:15] <pumabot> * [email protected]
[22:27:15] <pumabot> * Other
[22:27:38] <strugee> okay neat
[22:27:53] <strugee> so 5.0 is out! whooohooo
[22:28:24] <jxself> Yes, hooray!
[22:28:58] <strugee> there are a bunch of changes here but the biggest by far is that Node 0.10/0.12 aren't supported anymore
[22:29:00] <strugee> I was so excited
[22:29:21] <strugee> I deleted so much code :D
[22:29:46] <strugee> also the systemd unit we ship has better security which is also great! and there's various fixes and improvements too
[22:30:08] <larjona> hello!
[22:30:16] <strugee> \o/
[22:30:20] <strugee> hello larjona!
[22:30:33] <strugee> do you want to take over chairing? we're still on the first topic
[22:30:38] <strugee> pumabot: current agenda item
[22:30:38] <pumabot> TOPIC: Pump.io code development
[22:30:38] <pumabot> * 5.0.0!!
[22:30:38] <pumabot> * ActivityPub implementation
[22:30:38] <pumabot> * CloudFlare DNS changes
[22:30:38] <pumabot> * [email protected]
[22:30:39] <pumabot> * Other
[22:30:43] <larjona> pumabot larjona is chairing
[22:30:43] <pumabot> larjona: ok, larjona is now chairing this meeting.
[22:30:50] <larjona> congratulations for the relase
[22:30:52] <larjona> release*
[22:31:08] <strugee> \o/ whoohoooo!
[22:31:40] <larjona> I've read something about incompatibility between 0.3 and 5.0 (servers can talk to each other?) Or maybe that's solved
[22:32:28] <strugee> so it's because of a crash introduced in 3.0
[22:32:57] <strugee> the fix just got released as a part of the 5.0 release BUT I backported it to 4.1.1 too
[22:33:23] <strugee> so we need the network to upgrade to 4.1.2 or preferably 5.0.0 and then it will be fixed
[22:33:35] <larjona> I mean, most of the e14n are down so no interaction in any case, but I wonder about identi.ca, not sure in which version it is
[22:33:36] <strugee> unfortunately there's nothing we can do from the "outside"
[22:33:46] -*- strugee checks
[22:34:09] <strugee> 3.0.1 apparently :/
[22:34:38] <larjona> ok, I'll send a message to Evan about this issue, hopefully he can upgrade identi.ca (and maybe recover and upgrade the others)
[22:34:48] <strugee> yeah that'd be great
[22:35:10] <strugee> speaking of which I think he said he wanted to switch all the e14n nodes to using Docker
[22:35:18] <strugee> I really should fix the Docker image
[22:36:26] <larjona> anything else about 5.0.0?
[22:36:37] <strugee> it builds and stuff but there's a *super* weird problem where all connections are cut off before the HTTP request even comes through
[22:36:45] <strugee> so I'm REALLY not sure what's going on there
[22:36:52] <strugee> I don't think there's anything else about 5.0.0 though
[22:37:03] <larjona> ok, let's move then
[22:37:09] <larjona> pumabot next topic
[22:37:26] <larjona> pumabot next agenda item
[22:37:26] <pumabot> TOPIC: Branding
[22:37:49] -*- strugee makes a note to teach pumabot other common ways to phrase that
[22:37:51] <strugee> okay so branding
[22:37:53] <strugee> this is me
[22:38:06] <strugee> basically I have been thinking a lot recently about how we present ourselves
[22:38:33] <strugee> https://github.com/pump-io/pump-io.github.io/issues/19
[22:38:34] <pumabot> Refresh website branding · Issue #19 · pump-io/pump-io.github.io · GitHub
[22:38:56] <strugee> tl;dr I think we should focus on these three things that differentiate us from other projects:
[22:39:45] <strugee> * Security - we have some (planned) security features that improve all out-of-the-box setups that lots of other projects don't have
[22:40:06] <strugee> like automatic HTTPS support is planned, and we just shipped a restricted systemd file which reduces impact in the event of a compromise
[22:40:11] <strugee> second
[22:41:08] <-> bkuhn es ahora conocido como bkuhnIdle
[22:41:38] <strugee> * Great admin experience - it's incredibly simple to set up pump.io, especially if you don't need a reverse proxy
[22:42:07] <strugee> it Just Works(tm) out-of-the-box and we're getting ready to ship zero-downtime restarts which makes the admin experience even more awesome
[22:42:31] <strugee> we should push this especially hard since soooo many other projects are a ton of work to set up
[22:42:36] <strugee> and third,
[22:42:40] <strugee> * Flexibility through open standards
[22:43:23] <strugee> we've historically been very involved in the open standards in this space, and we're continuing that today
[22:43:59] <strugee> unlike e.g. Mastodon, we also focus on having a more "generic" platform that people can build stuff like OpenFarmGame on top of
[22:44:39] <strugee> basically I think we should find a way to concicely answer the question, "why wouldn't I just use <popular ActivityPub implementation>"?
[22:44:59] <strugee> which obviously becomes more important as we move towards implementing ActivityPub
[22:45:16] <strugee> sorry for the wall of text but does anyone have thoughts on ^^^ this?
[22:45:46] <larjona> I think we can get a summary of those 3 features to be shown in the main pump.io page, and then, maybe link to a wiki page (or another page, blogpost or whatever) about "why pump.io" with more extensive explanation
[22:46:00] <strugee> that's a great idea
[22:46:23] <strugee> we could write about each one as we ship features related to each one
[22:46:23] <larjona> Maybe we can publish a note in pump.io pointing to the issue, to encourage people to participate, or maybe write "testimonials"
[22:46:59] <larjona> and then for next month I can try to wrap up all the info in a specific proposal
[22:48:09] <strugee> yeah that sounds good
[22:48:17] <larjona> ok
[22:48:25] <strugee> awesome
[22:48:31] <strugee> do you want to write something up or should I?
[22:49:02] <larjona> as you wish. I probably cannot do anything before Monday, though
[22:49:54] <strugee> okay
[22:49:57] <strugee> I'm not terribly in a rush
[22:50:13] <larjona> I'll write something early next week, maybe sooner
[22:50:17] <strugee> it doesn't really matter me so just whoever gets to it first I guess
[22:50:22] <larjona> yes
[22:50:26] <larjona> pumabot next agenda item
[22:50:26] <pumabot> TOPIC: Community governance and sustainability
[22:50:26] <pumabot> * Conservancy membership
[22:50:26] <pumabot> * Node status
[22:50:26] <pumabot> * Node adoption
[22:50:26] <pumabot> * Funding
[22:50:35] <larjona> that's me
[22:51:02] <larjona> I didn't do my homework, I still need to send the "governance group" names to Conservancy :(
[22:51:13] <larjona> I hope to do it during this weekend
[22:51:30] <larjona> about the other subtopics, I don't know if there is any advancement
[22:52:37] <strugee> ok
[22:52:51] <strugee> I haven't heard anything about pumpit.info since like...
[22:52:53] <strugee> March?
[22:53:28] <strugee> so I guess there hasn't been any?
[22:53:58] <larjona> mmm
[22:55:54] <larjona> I guess we need to ping Evan about this issue too. I'm not sure if the Conservancy thing is a blocker about this, I guess no, since the domains and machines belong to E14N and their next owners are individuals
[22:57:06] <larjona> anything else about this topic?
[22:57:23] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] I don't think so
[22:57:30] <larjona> pumabot next agenda item
[22:57:31] <pumabot> larjona: that's the last agenda item.
[22:57:46] <larjona> ?
[22:57:46] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] (Laptop Wi-Fi dropped out)
[22:57:53] <larjona> what about Cloudflare?
[22:58:00] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] We're done I guess
[22:58:12] <larjona> and ActivityPub
[22:58:14] <larjona> ?
[22:58:18] <larjona> Did I miss them?
[22:58:24] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Oh those were in the code topic
[22:58:36] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] We missed them
[22:58:53] <larjona> ah, they were subtopics of development. Sorry
[22:59:00] <larjona> Can we talk about them?
[22:59:09] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Yeah definitely
[22:59:20] <larjona> So, CloudFlare DNS changes
[22:59:29] <larjona> this is https://github.com/pump-io/pump-io.github.io/issues/18
[22:59:31] <pumabot> Throw Cloudflare in front of http://pump.io · Issue #18 · pump-io/pump-io.github.io · GitHub
[22:59:55] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Needs Evan
[23:01:29] <larjona> I've just read the whole issue
[23:01:43] <larjona> it's well explained, and thanks for all the things you already did, strugee
[23:02:03] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Yeah it's just on the agenda since I was gonna mention it to him :)
[23:02:11] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Sure larjona!
[23:02:41] <larjona> Ok so what I'll to is to send the whole log by mail to him, and summarize/highlight the topics that need his action
[23:02:51] <larjona> now ActivityPub
[23:03:16] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Okay yeah
[23:03:19] <larjona> Mastodon already deployed it! What about us? Can anybody (else than strugee) help?
[23:04:09] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] So I started working on the first part of this! Haven't had a whole lot of time because of school but I'm hoping to ship ActivityStreams 2.0 representations in 5.1
[23:04:20] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Which is a good first step
[23:04:54] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Honestly I'm not sure if anybody else can help here... there's a lot of deep changes that need to be made
[23:05:27] <larjona> Then the servers that upgrade to 5.1 cannot talk to the non-up-to-date? I'm not sure about what did we talk about backwards compatibility
[23:05:36] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] But I can write up a summary of what my plan is on GitHub if anyone wants to take a crack at it
[23:06:08] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] No no, servers that upgrade will be more compatible but we won't drop any old stuff until at least 6.0
[23:06:12] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Because of semver
[23:06:31] <larjona> ah, I thought more code had to be written to keep compatibility
[23:06:49] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Well yeah but
[23:06:57] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] We need transition time for the network anyway
[23:07:21] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] I want to ensure a gradual rollover, not split the network into new and old
[23:07:21] <jxself> There are the nodes that are slow to upgrade...
[23:07:39] <jxself> Like those still on 3.
[23:07:51] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] It shouldn't be hard since the protocols are pretty similar so there isn't a HUGE amount of code we need
[23:08:53] <larjona> The currently public notes will be viewable at least from web interface, once the compatibility is dropped?
[23:09:17] <larjona> If not, maybe somebody should help in creating a backup system or "move to static" system
[23:09:52] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] So when we drop compatibility basically *new* posts won't make it to their recipients
[23:09:58] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] But that's pretty far off
[23:10:28] <xmpp-pump> [strugee] Ideally we'll evaluate when to drop compatibility when we have better metrics on the network too
[23:13:24] <larjona> well, I don't know what else to say
[23:13:31] <larjona> did we finish?
[23:15:32] <strugee> ugh I should work on that
[23:15:35] <strugee> that'd be *really* useful to have
[23:15:38] <strugee> anyway
[23:15:48] <strugee> yeah I think so
[23:15:56] <strugee> I should fix pumabot so he doesn't skip over subtopics in the future
[23:15:59] <strugee> anyway
[23:16:09] <larjona> ok so let's hope next meeting more people can attend
[23:16:12] <strugee> sorry, internet is super laggy
[23:16:15] <larjona> pumabot end meeting
[23:16:16] <pumabot> Thank you all for attending! Logs will be posted on the wiki shortly at https://github.com/e14n/pump.io/wiki/Meeting-2017-09-15.
[23:16:16] <pumabot> Also, special thanks to larjona for chairing!
[23:16:16] <pumabot> See you next month!
[23:16:16] <pumabot> #############################################################
[23:16:16] <pumabot> END LOG
[23:16:16] <pumabot> #############################################################